Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby WoodButcher » February 19th 2015, 4:03am

Same deal w/o the extension, that trolley carries 50% of the door's weight. Adding the extension is adding more leverage to the equation.

Think of a lever and fulcrum, we just tripled the length of the lever.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby WoodButcher » February 19th 2015, 4:09am

Lol. This hinge makes me wish I still smoked weed.
This is one of those things that screams out for a good "sit down" and "look see."

With enough weed I would have sat there for days,,,

or until nature called.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby ronaldperu » February 19th 2015, 4:36am

97cargocrawler wrote:Wow! Some folks have tooooo much free time. Is that RUST damage I see there by the trolley cover?

RUST.jpg

is that scorpions ness...or is a nest of scorpions ? :confused: :banana-stoner:
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby Lumpy [OP] » February 19th 2015, 7:45pm

Great improvement this morning. After yesterday's complaint that the trolley was too tight in the track, I loosened it up. Just chuck it up in a vise and hit the small bearings with a 2 lb hammer. Just hit 'em right on the side of the bearing to go LOOSER. Hit 'em on the bracket fingers to go TIGHTER (the other direction). I hit them once toward tighter and it got worse. So I hit them twice toward looser and it's Goldylocks -

Image

It now opens well, slides rearward and forward well and gets close to closing well. Closing still requires that you make sure the trolley has not gone too far forward, then push it with the rear assist handle.

Maybe I'll experiment with a #10 bolt and nut to act as a stop for the forward movement of the trolley.

But for now, it's working great.


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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby jadesdan » July 12th 2016, 4:06pm

*post deleted*

Lumpy was kind enough to answer my question privately. I still might try this :D
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby jadesdan » July 13th 2016, 1:58pm

UPDATE

Since I was responsible for reviving this thread, I feel like I should contribute my two cents.

Once again, I'm jealous of the Gen1 guys :violin:

It appears that the gen2 vans (mine is 2002) have a different bracket and trolley than the gen1. They reversed which side the "backbone" of the hinge ears is on, and the way the whole assembly is stuffed in there, I can't see a way to extend it (although, I do like the ease of disassembly with these three bolts). I'm assuming for you guys who have done the mod, when the door is closed the trolley is pushed inboard an extra 3.5-3.625", but on my van, the trolley is pretty much "bottomed out" when the door is closed. I played around with some ideas of a spring loaded 3-part hinge, and/or an extendable bracket that slides in and out, but I only have about 20 minutes to devote to this this week, so I doubt I'll be exploring those options.

Anyway, I hope this helps the next gen2 guy who really wants bigger tires (or wheel spacers). I haven't given up yet, but I'm close :shock:


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looks like I can't even trim my way into bigger tires :violin:

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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby jadesdan » July 13th 2016, 9:53pm

So here's my new idea.... if I extend both brackets with a "filler" piece, then I'll maintain the same geometry when the door is closed, but once the trolley rotates 90 or so degrees out, the door will swing wider. The only downside is that I'll have to "notch" a section of the door out to accommodate the longer brackets.

note: the computer sketch is not to scale, but the measurements are there to judge the geometry relations. The second shot is from below and shows the approximate demo section. The blue is where the weather stip mates up.

Thoughts?
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby jadesdan » July 13th 2016, 9:55pm

shot from underneath, looking up
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby 97cargocrawler » July 14th 2016, 12:08am

jadesdan wrote:shot from underneath, looking up


Too bad this is a family friendly site.

Lift it 'till it's no longer an issue :2:
Last edited by 97cargocrawler on July 14th 2016, 12:10am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby 97cargocrawler » July 14th 2016, 12:09am

. :roll:
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby jadesdan » July 14th 2016, 1:38am

How did you deal with the slider before your big lift?
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby 97cargocrawler » July 14th 2016, 4:00pm

jadesdan wrote:How did you deal with the slider before your big lift?


While others messed with the hinges and sliced and diced the door, I left mine alone because I was still able to squeeze my *** through the 12" opening. I knew one day it wouldn't be an issue. I also contemplated (and bought and tested) using airbags to temporarily lift the side of the van high enough to clear the tire. I ended up lifting the van higher and didn't need the air bag.

I experimented with all the bits and pieces and each had a major tradeoff. Clears the tire, makes the door way more difficult to close... etc.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby dryhumor » July 19th 2016, 12:13am

I'm thinking about using actuators to make the door open up. My tires kinda stick out a lot now.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby MI_Ghost » July 19th 2016, 12:42am

dryhumor wrote:I'm thinking about using actuators to make the door open up. My tires kinda stick out a lot now.
Does that actuator come with the ladder truck your going to need just to get up to the door to open it? :lol: :lol:
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby jadesdan » July 29th 2016, 5:04am

SOLVED!!!!!!!


sort of

IMG_20160715_170708.jpg

So here it fabbed and painted (always paint, right Lumpy?) according to the original design. Unfortunately, the angle that this sits at would require me to notch out a piece of the body frame next to the weather strip.... not going to happen, so it's back to the drawing board.

IMG_20160728_194024.jpg

Version II has a slight hook to it, and clears the van body (it's also reinforced from underneath). Because this one is cocked off to the right (as we're looking at it) it requires a little more trimming of the door.

IMG_20160728_193848.jpg

Here's where I started cutting, using the drywall attachment on my dremel.

IMG_20160728_193901.jpg

It's dull, and slow, but cuts straight and doesn't run off on me :)

IMG_20160728_201605.jpg

Here's close to the final cut. I did notch out the door panel about 1/2" too much, and I ended up having to grind down that section to the left of the bolt holes.

IMG_20160728_210803.jpg

Here's what it looks like when it's closed. Not too bad, but I could have done better. I have a nice piece of rubber strip that should fit in there perfectly.

IMG_20160728_214252.jpg

Here it is open, not pretty, but you'll never see it unless your peaking behind the door.

So why the "sort of" remark? Well, I must have missed one of my measurements, because the door sits rearward in the van about 3/16". It still closes, but it's tight, and will be better when I add a spacer between the 3 hole bracket and the door. That will push it forward when it's in the closed position. Also, I only gained about 1" of extension through this whole thing. It's obviously longer than 1", but because the door now slides at an inward angle to the van, the farther back it slides, the less clearance. I've got another idea to give me that extra 1/2"-1" I need, but I'll save that for another night.

Sorry I don't have any pics of the tire clearance, it got dark and I had to come inside.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby MI_Ghost » July 29th 2016, 9:06am

I like the Idea, but I couldn't understand the measurements in your drawing.
Looks functional to me. But I have about a gazillion questions.

How long did you lengthen the pieces?

If your tucking the pivot into the door. Would the trim really need to be cut?

How much shorter would it need to be to not go past the seal and require cutting the door open?

Could you do a measurement from the top of the fender lip to the door trim panel?
Stock will be around 1.75" on a cargo, 1.25" on the passenger. I would be interested in the amount of increase.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby jadesdan » July 29th 2016, 5:37pm

Ghost, the measurements in the drawing are no where close to scale. I just "sketched" that up to see the ratio between the length added to the roller and the total door movement.

I just realized that I can add about 1/2" of length to the van side of the roller and it will still be functional, so I'm going to take it off, disassemble (grind and break the welds) and make it longer. When I do that, I'll take measurements.

The other problem with clearance, is the door is no longer parallel to the van body when it's open.... the back of the door is angled away. So when the door is half open (the roller is just passing the wheel) you have the most clearance, but as you keep going backward that distance closes. It's hard to explain, but think about two sides of a triangle... the closer you are to the point, the smaller the gap between to two sides.

Pics and updates to follow.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby TurnNburn » December 29th 2016, 10:30pm

Now that I am in the territory where this is going to come into a factor when I buy my next set of tires, has anyone come up with a solution to this in the last 6 months on the second gens?
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby nosxjeep » February 16th 2017, 5:09pm

Love this!
I mentioned this type of mod in another thread and was led here!
Excellent work from everyone and I love seeing the 2nd Gen Bracket work.
I hope to contribute in the future.
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Re: Solving the Slider Door with Big Tires Problem

Postby sixsix » February 17th 2017, 4:36pm

Bruce, I just went back and reread the thread and it seems a recurring theme is... "make sure the bracket is positioned or oriented..." or "get the bracket to fold back right".

Is it possible that a well-positioned spring or sheet-metal backing might ensure the added length goes the right way before it goes around the corner?
Just a thought & my .02.



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