Another 1999 Astro with no-start problem.

[jbrow1]

Ok this van is driving me nuts. It used to not start when it was damp out or raining. If I started it every day then it was not much of a problem. Then one day it would not start again, big ole backfire. Researched on the net, found a bunch of stuff, and now this forum, which seemed like the place to go.

I have replaced plugs/wires/cap/rotor/coil, all NAPA parts, a brand new battery from Advance auto. Van still will not start, and rolls over rather difficult, will almost fire up, then backfire or stop rolling like the batt is to weak to turn it over.

I don't get why the van seems to be cranking slowly with a new battery and a boost charger on it. I also even after replacing all these parts, still see some random sparks at night from the coil arear and the area where the three plug wires on the drivers side are near eachother at the first wire holder. Again, brand new stuff..

Fuel pump sounds fine when run with the key. A buddy of mine told me I should check the oil and see if it is saturated with fuel from being way to flooded for so long. Not sure if that would make it crank hard, or if there could be fuel sitting in any of the cylinders.. Wonder if I should have turned it over with no plugs in to make sure everything was clear?.

Anyhow, very frustrating problem. And now after throwing parts/money at it, I need to get it running and drive it for another year to make it worth my while! Not that the parts/money matter, it's been a great van with almost 200,000 miles on it, definately deserved a tune-up!

[Lumpy]

Distributor advance.

Timing chain.


Lump

[jbrow1]

Are you saying you can change the timing on these? I thought it looked like the metal lockdown fit on a square slot on the distrubutor shaft and it was in a fixed position.

I mentioned timing chain maybe jumping a gear during a big backfire to my buddy and he thought they had a nylon gear or something and it would just break rather than skip or anything, in which case my distributor wouldn't go around when the engine cranked.

Any thoughts to that? I'm just thowing out conversations I've already had with others, and am open to all other ideas as well. Just trying to keep from towing it to a shop if I don't have to.

[paintdrying]

If you are seeing sparks then that will cause a no start. Napa tune up parts have caused some people trouble. What does the spark from the coil look like? Hold the coil wire close to the block, you need a nice strong blue spark.
If it is turning over slowly then your starter maybe bad. If your oil is thin or compression low you will need the full power crank over to get it to fire. Have you tried ether?
Coils do go bad, and it sound like your coil maybe weak. Post back

[jbrow1]

Coil was just replaced yesterday (napa), that's why I was so surprised to see any sparks at all from that area in the dark. I have tried ether, but not since replacing the coil, I will try that in about an hour.

Sounds like a snapping sound (jumping electricity) in there somewhere, I can't say where for sure. But kind of sounds like it's coming from within the distributor. Any ideas what that noise could be?

[Jasen]

Some caps are made with inferior plastics that are pour at preventing voltage leak and cross fire. The good caps aren't cheap, and throwing money at it isn't what we like do around here, but you might pick up the a Delco, Delphi or Accel. I run the Accel with brass, it cost $50 but so far has done fine. I also applied dielectric grease to the rim of the dist. to help seal the cap. from moisture and voltage leak.

[Jasen]

Another thought and just tossing it out there. I've read here that sometimes the wires to the coil can corrode in the insulation for a number of inches. Although there was just a bit of corrosion at the end terminal it wasn't really noticeable how bad it was until the insulation was stripped back.

[Leeann_93]

Just an FYI: the NAPA cap & rotor I put on my Bravada was the WORST I've ever tried. They don't seem to be able to figure out the stuff for the 4.3.

Switch to Standard, Accel or Delco with brass terminals. For wires, Delco or Autolite Premium. I had arcing & weaker spark with other brands. For coils, Delco only. Other brands are cheaper for a reason. I learned the hard way...

[paintdrying]

I was waiting for someone else to say something about napa stuff. I will not buy napa stuff. I have had nothing but serious problems. Bad caps, rotors that lose there metal after 100 miles. It is ac delco or nothing for me.

[strom]

I was going nuts with a similar problem. Seems to be common in VORTEC engines. The distributor cap has leads that criss-cross the These break down (or were never any good). I have found that Accel is the most reliable. I also found that if I hit a HARD bump or dip in the front like a speed bump that causes the front end to bottom out, it can cause the distributor cap to hit the dog-house. His can also cause the cap to fail.

[jbrow1]

Well guess it's time to tow the van to a professional. Has spark coming off the coil, had the module next to the coil tested and it was good 7 tests in a row. So any thoughts on why I would have spark going into the distrubutor, but only a weak spark to any plug wire once in awhile?

Also, the van rolls over extremely hard anybody have thoughts on that? The oil is not flooded with fuel or anything. Think I may pull all the plugs and roll it over to see if it has a bunch of fuel sitting in one of the cyclinders.

[unlimitedweld]

I took my 88 astro into a shop today because it would not start all the time. I was driving it and it died on me, making me steer it to the side of the road. I tried to get it started then but no luck. I called a tow truck to take it back home. I then looked at the distributor area and changed out the cap, rotor, ignition module (points) and the coil. I had to grind off the rivets on the old coil to free up the bracket for the new one. The rivets seemed to be aluminum and were taken down by a dremel type tool I had. Then I drove it two blocks to put more gas in it and afterward, it would not start! Plenty of battery and cranking, but no fire. I got help in pushing the van to the street and returned to it one and a half hours later, it started right away, and drove it home. I took it the next day to a shop and they ran it until it died. They replaced the pick up assy on the distributor and now it runs fine.

[jbrow1]

What part is the "pickup assy" on the distributor? I just replaced the little part that the plug plugs into and still no go. Just waiting to get it towed to the shop as it's beyond me how come I can have spark going out the end of the coil wire, into the distributor, but not much spark coming out of it. NAPA gave me a new cap/rotor under warranty yesterday so I could try and eliminate the old, but new dist cap/rotor as the problem. Had the ecm by the coil tested 7 times, all good, new coil, new wires, new plugs etc. Checked fuel pressure and it's at 60+ with a snap on tester.

[Phantom]

how come I can have spark going out the end of the coil wire, into the distributor, but not much spark coming out of it. NAPA gave me a new cap/rotor under warranty yesterday so I could try and eliminate the old, but new dist cap/rotor as the problem. Had the ecm by the coil tested 7 times, all good, new coil, new wires, new plugs etc. Checked fuel pressure and it's at 60+ with a snap on tester.

The ECM is not by the coil ,, that is the ignition control module ,, when it was tested , who tested it and how did they test it , it can be weak and cause problems , the cam sensor or wiring can be bad and not providing the electrical voltage needed , crank sensor or wiring can be weak and cause this problem , if bad or if wiring is loose or exposed , moisture can render it troublesome

You say "but not much spark coming out of it. "
so there is some spark ?
if your plugs are gaped too wide it will cause spark to be weak cause it has to jump too far

[MadMaxiVan]

yes.
my experience was similiar and i put a ground wire from the end of the starter,
theres a long case bolt,attach lead there,
run it back up to the firewall see where they have a factory ground pass side firewall Stud /
connect to that and then run another wire back over to your negative battery post.

thus completing the circle.

had several times where my van kept saying low battery/check gauges/
even tho they were new batteries...?

now it starts up quicker than ever before.

[jbrow1]

how come I can have spark going out the end of the coil wire, into the distributor, but not much spark coming out of it. NAPA gave me a new cap/rotor under warranty yesterday so I could try and eliminate the old, but new dist cap/rotor as the problem. Had the ecm by the coil tested 7 times, all good, new coil, new wires, new plugs etc. Checked fuel pressure and it's at 60+ with a snap on tester.

The ECM is not by the coil ,, that is the ignition control module ,, when it was tested , who tested it and how did they test it , it can be weak and cause problems , the cam sensor or wiring can be bad and not providing the electrical voltage needed , crank sensor or wiring can be weak and cause this problem , if bad or if wiring is loose or exposed , moisture can render it troublesome

You say "but not much spark coming out of it. "
so there is some spark ?
if your plugs are gaped too wide it will cause spark to be weak cause it has to jump too far

Thanks for all the input. Talked to a buddy who told me to take the serpentine belt off and see if the alt was locked up, which it was. Van rolled over much better with the belt off. Heck, I almost thought it was going to start. Rolling over faster improved the spark at the plug, but still not sparking as it should. Very intermittantly. Sparks a-plenty coming out of the coil wire. Finally have given up and had it towed to a shop. The owner seemed pretty confident it would be something simple, so I am keeping my fingers crossed that is how it turns out.

[jbrow1]

Shop just called and said the starter was junk, rolling slow and drawing all kinds of amps. When they put a new one in it fired right up I wondered about that, but was tired of throwing money at guesses. But, it's almost got 200,000 miles, so everything I put on it, was well deserved tune-up material He also said the alternator was locked up so tight it broke in half when he tried to get it to spin. I expected that as well after putting a wrench on that before having it towed to the shop.

[jbrow1]

Ahh, refreshing. And then back to the same old schtick. Van was running beautifully smooth, then left it idling for about ten minutes and when I took off it now has a miss again. Going to get the fuel filter changed and see if that may have anything to do with it, then time to start checking wires as I've read about in other places.

My check engine light is on, and then it will consistently blink for a bit, then just stay on again. Does this mean anything to anybody?

My ignition control module was tested at Autozone, they did seven tests in a row to see if it would heat up and then have a failed test. It passed all seven.

Where is the cam sensor located? I think my next step after a fuel filter is to start checking all the wires..

[Leeann_93]

When it's blinking, you have an active misfire that could damage the engine or the cat (or both). Staying on means you've had a misfire within the last 3 ignition cycles.

Double-check the routing of your #5 cylinder plug wire. It's the most difficult to put on the plug and has the most sharp and hot metal obstacles to get to the cap. I finally had to give up and encase the wire in concoluted tubing (aka wire loom) with the ends wrapped in electrical tape and one wrap in the middle. No more misfire.

Before the tubing, one of the metal bits the wire runs near actually ate a hole in the wire (melted one and cut the other), causing a huge spark leak.