Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby snailsafari [OP] » July 13th 2020, 5:12am

99 GMC Safari AWD since this forum does not distinguish posts by generation.

All rods are connected and I'm able to open from interior after removing trim by twisting connector bar manually. There is power to the rear 12v adapter socket.

Power locks are an issue throughout the van, although I've noticed that the driver door automatically locks when I reconnect the battery. No other doors power lock during battery connection and no doors respond to power lock button during normal operation or otherwise. Currently I can only open the upper Dutch door manually from the interior.

I'm not sure what the button is supposed to do, when I look inside it appears to be connected only to wired socket so I assume there is no manual bypass and it must be powered in order to operate. I unplugged the electric connection directly above the push button since it appears to be connected to the actuator, stuck a multimeter against the connection plates and wasn't able to get a reading.

Don't know where the wires run to. Thoughts?
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby sixsixsixsix is online! » July 13th 2020, 5:59pm

snailsafari wrote:99 GMC Safari AWD since this forum does not distinguish posts by generation.

All rods are connected and I'm able to open from interior after removing trim by twisting connector bar manually. There is power to the rear 12v adapter socket.

Power locks are an issue throughout the van, although I've noticed that the driver door automatically locks when I reconnect the battery. ...


Says the locks are continuously being 'energized' ( or pressed or actuated or something... )?
.

Well, after all... what would Banacek say ?... Anyone that condones the actions of the American People during the Storming of the Capitol are as complicit as the Assholes themselves.
But no way does this let the Democrats or the MSM off the Hook.

.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby M_a_t_t » July 13th 2020, 6:24pm

snailsafari wrote:99 GMC Safari AWD since this forum does not distinguish posts by generation.


I like that about this forum.

snailsafari wrote:All rods are connected and I'm able to open from interior after removing trim by twisting connector bar manually. There is power to the rear 12v adapter socket.

Do you mean the rear cigarette lighter?

snailsafari wrote:Power locks are an issue throughout the van, although I've noticed that the driver door automatically locks when I reconnect the battery. No other doors power lock during battery connection and no doors respond to power lock button during normal operation or otherwise. Currently I can only open the upper Dutch door manually from the interior.

I'm not sure what the button is supposed to do, when I look inside it appears to be connected only to wired socket so I assume there is no manual bypass and it must be powered in order to operate. I unplugged the electric connection directly above the push button since it appears to be connected to the actuator, stuck a multimeter against the connection plates and wasn't able to get a reading.

Don't know where the wires run to. Thoughts?

Are you referring to the button on the hatch or the button on the dash?

Did you try just applying 12v to the hatch actuator or any of the door locks? That will confirm if its a wiring or a hardware issue. It sounds like a wiring issue though.

Should be able to get the wiring diagram through AstroWill's link:

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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby Leeann_93 » July 13th 2020, 11:17pm

1999 LOCK.jpg


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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby Rinny » July 13th 2020, 11:39pm

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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby sfeaver » July 14th 2020, 3:01am

The doors have to be unlocked for that button to work...
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby Rinny » July 14th 2020, 10:51pm

sfeaver wrote:The doors have to be unlocked for that button to work...

I assumed he knew that but very possible he overlooked that fact.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby snailsafari [OP] » July 15th 2020, 11:10pm

Thanks all for the feedback so far. I came across the wiring diagram from Astro Will's site, and was able to determine that the remote control is on a separate relay than the rest. So I cleaned up the remote and replaced the battery. When used, the drivers side door and the rear doors lock and unlock on button press. Passenger and sliding door do not respond. Push button on rear upper door still has no response regardless of lock/unlock status. Interior power lock switches don't do anything.

sixsix wrote:Says the locks are continuously being 'energized' ( or pressed or actuated or something... )?

sixsix, not sure what this means. I do know that there is no response from any locks when pushing power lock buttons on doors, either up or down. Driver and rear door respond to remote, so I don't think it's an issue of a short causing them to continuously lock or something like that? Could be failed actuators? Or relay? Not really sure on this vehicle which ones are more likely to give up the ghost.

M_a_t_t wrote:Do you mean the rear cigarette lighter?

Are you referring to the button on the hatch or the button on the dash?

Did you try just applying 12v to the hatch actuator or any of the door locks? That will confirm if its a wiring or a hardware issue. It sounds like a wiring issue though.

Matt, 12v adapter socket aka cigarette lighter. My van doesn't have the button on the dash which would be a darn cool feature. Just the exterior button at the upper dutch door. Currently no response on press. I do have a spare 12v battery, I suppose the procedure is to connect a wire from (+/-) terminals to (+/-) posts on actuator?

Leann, thanks for wiring diagrams, awesome. I stumbled across those after posting this, but I appreciate you taking the time to post the '99 diagrams directly to this thread.

Rinny wrote:https://www.astrosafari.com/viewtopic.php?f=76&t=142356

Rinny thank you for posting this, I will give that a run through tonight and update.

Thanks all.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby MechBob » July 15th 2020, 11:42pm

There is no Cig. lighter in the back of the van, just a power outlet.And, they are on a different fuse than the front cig. lighter.Recheck your fuses,should be fuse #13. is shown in owners manual. If you do not have one, they are listed on this site main page.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby snailsafari [OP] » July 16th 2020, 4:14am

Went ahead and pulled out the push button, disassembled cleaned and replaced it. It was dirty and evidence of burn marks, the little copper piece was corroded even. I wire brushed it back smooth and replaced. No change to situation.

I'll try connecting the actuator to a 12v power source and pull interior fuses tomorrow and report back.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby The Drummer » July 16th 2020, 10:13am

Twice on mine i left the rear hatch open ,it rained ... twice , and twice the little circuit in the rear hatch button went south ,i replaced it ...twice , and it fixed it ...twice , i did try to clean it ..twice and both times euuuuu i mean twice it did not work ,in my case i knew the actuator was ok .
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby sixsixsixsix is online! » July 16th 2020, 8:05pm

sixsix wrote:
snailsafari wrote:99 GMC Safari AWD since this forum does not distinguish posts by generation.

All rods are connected and I'm able to open from interior after removing trim by twisting connector bar manually. There is power to the rear 12v adapter socket.

Power locks are an issue throughout the van, although I've noticed that the driver door automatically locks when I reconnect the battery. ...


Says the locks are continuously being 'energized' ( or pressed or actuated or something... )?



snailsafari wrote:sixsix, not sure what this means.


I said that becuz you said they locked as soon as you did the batt. So... maybe the circuit is continuously "ON".
.

Well, after all... what would Banacek say ?... Anyone that condones the actions of the American People during the Storming of the Capitol are as complicit as the Assholes themselves.
But no way does this let the Democrats or the MSM off the Hook.

.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby snailsafari [OP] » July 16th 2020, 8:26pm

The Drummer wrote:Twice on mine i left the rear hatch open ,it rained ... twice , and twice the little circuit in the rear hatch button went south ,i replaced it ...twice , and it fixed it ...twice , i did try to clean it ..twice and both times euuuuu i mean twice it did not work ,in my case i knew the actuator was ok .


Drummer, do you have the part number or name to find a replacement online?
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby Rinny » July 16th 2020, 10:34pm

snailsafari wrote:Went ahead and pulled out the push button, disassembled cleaned and replaced it. It was dirty and evidence of burn marks, the little copper piece was corroded even. I wire brushed it back smooth and replaced. No change to situation.

I'll try connecting the actuator to a 12v power source and pull interior fuses tomorrow and report back.


That was not a waste of time because eventually it has to be done. Sorry it was not the fix.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby snailsafari [OP] » July 17th 2020, 9:13pm

Rinny wrote:That was not a waste of time because eventually it has to be done. Sorry it was not the fix.


Rinny, Definitely glad I pulled it. For all I know it ALSO didn't work and was masking other issues because......

MechBob wrote:There is no Cig. lighter in the back of the van, just a power outlet.And, they are on a different fuse than the front cig. lighter.Recheck your fuses,should be fuse #13. is shown in owners manual. If you do not have one, they are listed on this site main page.


Because ironically, when I pulled and replaced fuse #13, the rear door push button started working again. The rear door was locking and unlocking on remote press, but with a new fuse in #13, now the the push button activates the actuator from both door switch and remote press. The wiring remains a bit mysterious to me since the locks were working and even the dang 12v socket was pushing power and lighting up an adapter i stuck in there before swapping the 20a fuse. But whatever, new 20a fuse fixed most door switches and most lock issues.

Passenger side door still not working, but is now showing response eg I can see the lock wiggle up 1/16" on unlock, and wiggle down 1/16" on lock. The window on that side also struggles, usually it'll open no problem but it will take a handful of tries over the course of 30 minutes to get closed back up again. I'm thinking the wiring behind the door panel is damaged or loose. I'll pull it this weekend and report back.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby dchan51360 » July 17th 2020, 9:41pm

That window problem is most likely a bad motor. I'm sure many of the long time astro/safari owners have had that one. Be careful as eventually it will just not go up, no matter what you do.

If it's original, good chance it's on it's last legs. When I did mine, it was an original riveted on motor. The replacement motor came with instructions to drill out the rivets to replace.

Been happy ever since. (5 years now)

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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby sixsixsixsix is online! » July 17th 2020, 9:45pm

snailsafari wrote: ... The window on that side also struggles, usually it'll open no problem but it will take a handful of tries over the course of 30 minutes to get closed back up again. I'm thinking the wiring behind the door panel is damaged or loose. I'll pull it this weekend and report back.

You may just need a new Window Motor and a good cleaning of the Locking Mechanical Grab-bag inside probably wouldn't hurt.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby dchan51360 » July 17th 2020, 9:50pm

The fact that the solenoid/lock actuator is moving the lever up and down slightly tells me you probably have a lube problem in the door. This MAY also resolve your slow/intermittent window problem at least temporarily but If you are going to open up that door, you might as well replace the motor..

The lube problem... There may be some dried lube grease on a lot of the moving parts in that door. If all the components in a door are beginning to bind/rust/not slide smoothly the actuators may not have enough strength to overcome the resistance being caused by the friction.Your lock actuator may be an issue with the connection right at the lock cylinder so that all the connecting rods move some but not enough to actually throw the lock mechanism.

The grease getting gummy on the regulator (all the sliding parts of the window) may be just enough to strain or overheat the motor. It will bog down or stop. Then when it cools off, it may work again for a few more inches, then stop again. By helping the window up manually you are just prolonging the eventual failure of that motor.

The quick "dirty" fix is to lube up all the contact points of moving parts in the door. But since you are going to open up the door panel to look in there and probably have to at least pull a few of the linkages off to clean (replace the plastic end retainers) It would probably be prudent to replace that motor as well.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby MechBob » July 17th 2020, 11:11pm

1-The keyless entry operates the locks off a different fuse than the buttons,inside
2-Fuse 13 feeds the rear hatch, and the door lock buttons,inside_
3-The cig. lighter is fed by fuse 13.The power outlets, front and rear, are on a different fuse.
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Re: Upper Dutch door no response to push button

Postby snailsafari [OP] » July 22nd 2020, 5:05am

dchan51360 wrote:The fact that the solenoid/lock actuator is moving the lever up and down slightly tells me you probably have a lube problem in the door. This MAY also resolve your slow/intermittent window problem at least temporarily but If you are going to open up that door, you might as well replace the motor..

The lube problem... There may be some dried lube grease on a lot of the moving parts in that door. If all the components in a door are beginning to bind/rust/not slide smoothly the actuators may not have enough strength to overcome the resistance being caused by the friction.Your lock actuator may be an issue with the connection right at the lock cylinder so that all the connecting rods move some but not enough to actually throw the lock mechanism.

The grease getting gummy on the regulator (all the sliding parts of the window) may be just enough to strain or overheat the motor. It will bog down or stop. Then when it cools off, it may work again for a few more inches, then stop again. By helping the window up manually you are just prolonging the eventual failure of that motor.

The quick "dirty" fix is to lube up all the contact points of moving parts in the door. But since you are going to open up the door panel to look in there and probably have to at least pull a few of the linkages off to clean (replace the plastic end retainers) It would probably be prudent to replace that motor as well.


I opened up the door panel today. Surprisingly easy. The lock assembly moved fine manually and with no resistance. Visually everything is clean and the dust panel was intact. Voltage measured to the lock actuator from the switch read low, anywhere from 5-8v with occasional peaks at 11.8v.

Cleaned the contact with electronic cleaning spray which made no difference to readings. Wiring harness is entirely intact within the door, so I'm not sure how to fix low voltage issue at lock.

Window motor read a solid and clean 12.0-12.3v from the switch. Visually the gear and regulator parts all look clean but it's obviously cramped so I can't see well. Touching the window it feels like it moves smoothly before the motor shuts off, not the rough or unsteady pace you might expect from dirt/grime/rust.

Ordering a new acdelco window motor from Rock Auto now...
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