Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » January 22nd 2018, 11:34pm

I've been looking around at what to do with my rear heater lines after I removed the rear heater last summer. I found some great solutions (like ChevyMaher and Lumpy's ball valves on the heater core lines) but want to clarify some information for myself and anyone else looking to do something similar - aka deleting the heater valve/bypass valve for a rear heat delete/bypass, or whatever it's called.

I've been looking around for a while and the information just doesn't seem to all be there for noobs like myself. So I'm hoping to give some dumbed down information AND get some questions answered here so it can become a resource for everybody. All my information and pictures are for a 1997, so I'm not sure if this is the same across all generations.

OK, first thing is that on a van with rear heat there are two valves, a six port valve (2nd picture here - https://goo.gl/yH9BMT) and this two port valve on the rear heater line (https://goo.gl/VoxnNa). On a van without rear heat there is just one four port valve (first picture here - https://goo.gl/yH9BMT). All these valves have vacuum lines attached that allow them to function. The reason for the 4 vs 6 difference is vans with rear heat have two extra lines (one out to the rear carrying hot coolant, and one returning) that are also a part of the overall cooling hose system.

The four port valve has two hoses that go to the heater core (one out, one back) - these connect to the heater core (that gives you internal heat in the van) on the passenger side of the firewall. Another hose comes from the manifold (passenger, front, top of the engine on my 1997) and connects to the valve, and the last connects to a "T" in the lower radiator hose, which flows from the passenger side lower of the radiator into the water pump dead center in the front of the engine. So for both we've got one inlet and one outlet, and two for the heater core. The six port also has the two extra lines to/from the rear heater as I already mentioned, AND instead of flowing into the lower radiator hose, it has a line directly to the water pump. Just aft of the six port is the two port rear heater valve, which is just a gateway that turns it on and off essentially.
Ok, hopefully that was dumbed down enough for everyone to get. Now pictures!

This is with a bunch of stuff disconnected and taken off, so it will look different without disassembling the airbox, shrouds, and fan.

Colors mean the same things throughout.

Overall what we're looking at -
1.jpg

Red line connects intake manifold to six port heater valve, orange connects water pump to six port valve, pink are the two lines going to the heater core, and green is heading to the two port valve and then the rear heater.
1 labeled.jpg

A closer view -
2.jpg

Colors are the same.
2 labeled.jpg

A little lower -
3.jpg

Now we can see the green heading off aft a bit better and see purple - this is the rear heat return line. Notice how it meets the six port connector directly across from the hose to the water pump.
3 labeled.jpg

Another view where you can see the purple rear heat return coming from the darkness -
4.jpg

A view of the rear heater control valve -
5.jpg

Another view -
6.jpg

Here we see the lines running the the heater core (just out of the picture to the right is the six port valve). The lines head toward the passenger side of the car and then turn towards the back and run into the firewall.
2018-01-22 12.56.47.jpg


Ok! Now for the questions.

1 - Is the line from the intake manifold to the valve bringing heated coolant, and the line from the valve to the water pump returning (somewhat) cooled coolant?
2 - If this is correct, then when other members here eliminated these valves and eliminated rear heat, did they simply make an output line from the intake manifold to the heater core (with a ball valve in it) and a return line from the heater core to the water pump? (perhaps with a second ball valve as Lumpy added later)
3 - If this is correct, do these lines need to be secured in some places? Is rubbing a concern? Is heat from the engine a concern? Could I just use flexible rubber hose and ziptie in strategic spots?
4 - For the vacuum lines on the valves, you have to plug them, correct? How do you plug them?
Capture.JPG

Based on this diagram, it looks like the purple and orange lines would become unnecessary - could I just cut the lines by the firewall and plug them there?

5 - What hose is this/what does it do?
Has one connection at the front of the manifold
11.jpg

22.jpg

Now looking at it through the doghouse, it comes over the valve covers
33.jpg

And looks like it connects to the exhaust manifold
44.jpg

I haven't been able to find what this does/is - any help would be appreciated!

Someday when these questions are answered I'll get around to doing this project and detail what I did here. Until then, thanks all for the help! :ty:

For some extra reference, I found helpful stuff here, here, here, here, and here:
viewtopic.php?f=43&t=108033&p=1083945&hilit=coolant+bypass#p1083945
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=86761&p=834410&hilit=coolant+bypass#p834410
viewtopic.php?f=43&t=30161&p=308170&hilit=coolant+bypass#p308170
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=14185&p=151369&hilit=coolant+bypass#p151369
viewtopic.php?f=34&t=10216&hilit=coolant+bypass&start=20

Edit: how do you make pictures not sideways? (other than clicking on them)
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby konybravo » January 23rd 2018, 12:12am

Regarding question #5- this is your EGR line, comming out of the exhaust manifold, and should be connected to the valve, itself- a cilindric body, on the right side of the thermostat,with an electrical connector on top, that u've apparently taken out.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby konybravo » January 23rd 2018, 12:19am

#4- if u delete the HCV, it will be enough to put a screw into the violet and orange vacuum hose ends, in order to not lose vacuum. That's what I did. Or, if they're plastic- cut'n melt the ends.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » January 23rd 2018, 1:38am

konybravo wrote:#4- if u delete the HCV, it will be enough to put a screw into the violet and orange vacuum hose ends, in order to not lose vacuum. That's what I did. Or, if they're plastic- cut'n melt the ends.

Ok, that makes sense - would it be better to smear some RTV on the screw beforehand, or is that not even necessary?

konybravo wrote:Regarding question #5- this is your EGR line, comming out of the exhaust manifold, and should be connected to the valve, itself- a cilindric body, on the right side of the thermostat,with an electrical connector on top, that u've apparently taken out.

Thanks Kony! Yeah, I have the EGR off right now because I just did the IM gaskets
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby AstroWill » January 23rd 2018, 1:52am

A screw, a golf tee, a vacuum cap on the other end and remove the hose, anything to block it off, I don't think RTV is necessary, but it wouldn't hurt either.

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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby konybravo » January 23rd 2018, 8:15am

AstroWill wrote:A screw, a golf tee, a vacuum cap on the other end and remove the hose, anything to block it off, I don't think RTV is necessary, but it wouldn't hurt either.

I, personally, would avoid using RTV, cus if by any, close to zero :lol: chance, a particle, gets sucked in, it would mess the controlls, or tge oparation of other vacuum controlled units... But hey- I'm a bit too hypochondric, regarding My Precioussssss :rofl:
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » January 23rd 2018, 9:36pm

AstroWill wrote:A screw, a golf tee, a vacuum cap on the other end and remove the hose, anything to block it off

Okie doke
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » January 23rd 2018, 9:37pm

Does anyone know what the answers to my first three questions are?

Is any of the information I gave incorrect? Hoping not to lead anyone astray if they use it for reference in the future.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby konybravo » January 23rd 2018, 10:09pm

Right on the contrary, u've made excelent, detailed pictures, and everything u describe is correct. I find your post very usefull!Good job! :thumbup:
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby Meterpig » January 25th 2018, 3:59am

Since you already deleted the rear heater ? (why?) Anyhow, rip out all the plastic, get some quality hose clamps and hose nipple for the appropriate size. A home depot trip is in order. The big hose carries the outlflow, the small hose the in flow. Everything is on the left side of the engine. Think 1950. Once you are done, the heater system will fluctuate in temp on high depending on pedal pressure. I noticed it after dumping all the plastic junk.

On mine, I found the 6 way plastic monster was ready to crack open. Because, you know, plastic does so amazing under heat and cold.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » January 25th 2018, 4:28am

Meterpig wrote:Since you already deleted the rear heater ? (why?)

Gutted the whole back to camperize it this summer.

Meterpig wrote: Once you are done, the heater system will fluctuate in temp on high depending on pedal pressure.

Like, push the pedal down and temp gauge jumps, let off and it falls kind of fluctuate? That'll be interesting.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » February 19th 2018, 11:14pm

I've got another quick question for ya'll on this - having a hard time deciphering what it says on Rockauto regarding the Inner Diameter of some of these hoses.

It looks like the hose leaving the IM to the valve is 3/4, but the hose from the "upper heater" to the valve (which I would assume is the inlet to the heater core) is 5/8. Then the "lower heater" to valve is 3/4 and from the valve to the water pump is 5/8, I think.

I just don't think I'm reading this right because I would assume it would be 3/4 all the way out the heater core, then 5/8 all the way back. Was going to buy ball valves to stick in there to cut out the valve, but don't want to buy the wrong ones. Also am going to buy ~5' of hose in both ID's because I probably won't be able to reuse it all/connect it all as is.

Thanks! :D
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby dramey » February 20th 2018, 12:10am

I eliminated the heater valves in my van. I used a 3/4 x 3/4 x 5/8" "T" fitting and a 5/8 x 5/8 x 5/8 "T" fitting. Going from engine to front heater core you have one 3/4 and one 5/8 hose. The rear heater uses 2 5/8 hoses. Front heater 3/4 from engine to 3/4 T, 3/4 T to 3/4 hose going to front heater core. The 5/8 fitting on the 3/4 x 3/4 x 5/8 connects to one of the 5/8 heater hoses going to the rear heater core. The 5/8 x 5/8 x 5/8 T gets connected to the 5/8 hose from the engine, the 5/8 hose to the front heater core and the remaining 5/8 connecting to the the rear heater hose. Buy a **** of heater hose clamps.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby 1lowcab » February 20th 2018, 12:26am

When you eliminate those valves you loose control over the heat, the heater control knob doesn't do anything anymore, right?
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby 1lowcab » February 20th 2018, 12:33am

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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » February 20th 2018, 3:16am

dramey wrote:I eliminated the heater valves in my van. I used a 3/4 x 3/4 x 5/8" "T" fitting and a 5/8 x 5/8 x 5/8 "T" fitting. Going from engine to front heater core you have one 3/4 and one 5/8 hose. The rear heater uses 2 5/8 hoses. Front heater 3/4 from engine to 3/4 T, 3/4 T to 3/4 hose going to front heater core. The 5/8 fitting on the 3/4 x 3/4 x 5/8 connects to one of the 5/8 heater hoses going to the rear heater core. The 5/8 x 5/8 x 5/8 T gets connected to the 5/8 hose from the engine, the 5/8 hose to the front heater core and the remaining 5/8 connecting to the the rear heater hose. Buy a **** of heater hose clamps.

Awesome! Thanks!
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1lowcab wrote:When you eliminate those valves you loose control over the heat, the heater control knob doesn't do anything anymore, right?

Nope, the heater knob still adjusts the heat - coolant is just always flowing through the heater core when you delete the valve, rather than only flowing through when you tell it to. I think the heat comes from the fan blowing over the heater core, and the knob adjusts the fan speed. The reason Maher and Lumpy put ball valves in the lines to their heater cores are to isolate it during the summer when they don't want the coolant flowing through and radiating extra heat, and affecting their A/C.

No idea about that valve, looks promising though!
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby dramey » February 20th 2018, 6:49am

I got my T's from the local auto parts store.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby SportsBoy [OP] » February 20th 2018, 8:29pm

Going to get metal just because.

Also a couple ball valves too.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby dramey » February 20th 2018, 11:17pm

Metal is fine. The ball valves are not needed unless you live in the South.
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Re: Clarifying heater valve delete/rear heater lines bypass

Postby TurnNburn » February 20th 2018, 11:22pm

That metal one would be awesome. Mine OE one still works, but I know how fragile they are... Same price as a crappy plastic knock off, but does that company make one for the astro? That one above doesn't list the astro, or even the 4.3 as a compatible option
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