Newbie from Minnesota

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Newbie from Minnesota

Postby mcspin50 [OP] » January 19th 2019, 12:41am

Hello all,
I've been looking for a new tow vehicle for my '84 13' Scamp to replace my '05 Chrysler T&C. I love the minivan for its large, enclosed space (did you know you can fit 4x8 sheets of plywood or two bicycles and a kayak in the back of them?) so I've steered away from pickups. The Astros/Safaris with their AWD seemed like a more powerful (but not too much more) alternative to the T&C so I can tow my trailer into the mountains of Utah and Colorado, where No. 1 Son and No. 2 Son live, without losing too much power on the ascents.
Have taken a couple Astros for test drives, but didn't find one that I liked. One had a lot of rust and the other was a fairly misleading ad on the condition.
Anyway, hope to learn what I need to look for when taking one for a test drive. And I hope you don't mind me posting a pic of my two wheeled modes of camping. I also have a teardrop trailer that I built 75% on my own, 25% with help.
Take care....Lil M.

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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby AstroWill » January 19th 2019, 12:47am

Welcome to the site!

I have always liked the scamp trailers, want to get one to pull behind my Tiger for when we have the kids with.

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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby mcspin50 [OP] » January 19th 2019, 1:05am

I love mine. It's easy to tow, although I still suck at backing it up. :-?
Found mine on the www.fiberglass-rv-4sale.com site when I wasn't really looking for one, but felt it was a good deal, plus there were two people waiting behind me if I passed it up. They go fast.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby zzimmer3 » January 19th 2019, 1:30am

I just bought my fourth Astro. When shopping these months I paid particular attention to the area behind the front bumper, mine rusted the radiator support and front bumper pretty badly, allowing the body to sag onto the subframe. All the parts are available to replace mentioned problems, but I looked until I found one without rust in this area..
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby astrometalvan » January 19th 2019, 1:58am

Things that I would look for in an Astro if wanting a tow rig and a little why on each:

1. Lay on ground and look behind running boards and closely around any body kit at the mounting places. Astros with body kits seem to pick up and hold road de-icing salt and rust out on driver side behind plastic cladding if they come from places where they salt the roads.
100_2917.JPG

Driver side more because cars going opposite direction throw salty sludge up at you.

2. The brake line behind the gas tank tends to hold dirt, which holds moisture and causes the steel tubing to rust out. I have fixed this on both our Astros. drop the fuel tank, cut bad line, install piece of new tube, reinstall fuel tank, get brakes bled. Do this when almost out of gas.

3. Condition means more than miles on the odometer. These things will go forever if you take good care of them. I am a mechanic by some curse and have had 2 Astros with over 260K miles. Yeah, stuff breaks, but it's astounding how durable they truly are. Bought our first one for $550 and had it 2 years and sold it for $1500, drove it better.. threw $50 at it every payday until it was a pretty good van. Put almost 30 K miles on it and musician son got bored with it and got a 65 Ford Falcon we restored/customized. He had the Falcon a while and figured out why I picked him out an Astro for his first car, and we ended up getting him another Astro. Too perfect for a young musician.

Got an AWD this time! WE LOVE IT! Get one!

Look for the RPO code sticker in the door jamb and look up your important codes. It will tell the rear end gear ratio. You want at least a GU6(3.42) but a GT4 (3.73) or GT5 (4.10) would be better for towing and mountains, but worse for fuel consumption.
RPO code sticker.JPG

There's also one magical code to look for: G80 it means the van has a factory locker in the rear and will be very capable off road with just an off-road tire swap.
A locking differential of some kind is the MOST IMPORTANT upgrade off road. This is the G80 the General put in ours:
100_3598.JPG


I would not consider a first generation Astro for your needs, they were much lighter duty trucks. Sportier, maybe more fun, but they used GM G-body (also S10) car suspension and brakes. The second gen use 1/2 ton truck (W/T 1500) rated suspension and brake components. The last model years even had 6 lug wheels and could tow over 6000 lbs with a weight distribution hitch. I would replace all 4 shocks immediately and use load-carrying coil-over shocks like these
100_2974.JPG

if you are going to tow on a regular basis or ride at or above 500lbs of cargo on a regular basis. Regular towing should also be accompanied by an auxillary trans cooler install. My son hauls Guitar amps, 4x12 cabinets and PA gear and has no problems. He doesn't really tow anything except other trucks out of the mud :rockon:

They are cramped under the hood and can be a pita to work on certain things, but not really much different from other vans. I've also had a 76 Econoline and a 65 Econoline and done much work on G20 vans too. Astros are the biggest little vans or maybe the littlest big van, I'm not sure, but they are great.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby mcspin50 [OP] » January 19th 2019, 3:58am

Thank you both so much for all that info! I'm going to have to take notes with me so I can be better informed! From looking at one vehicle, I went on youTube and found out how to replace the fan motor and the fan motor relay. The guy said the van was in perfect working and looking condition. He exaggerated. ;-/
Last edited by mcspin50 on January 19th 2019, 4:03am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby mcspin50 [OP] » January 19th 2019, 4:00am

Oops! Double post.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby mcspin50 [OP] » January 19th 2019, 4:13am

astrometalvan wrote:I would not consider a first generation Astro for your needs, they were much lighter duty trucks. Sportier, maybe more fun, but they used GM G-body (also S10) car suspension and brakes. The second gen use 1/2 ton truck (W/T 1500) rated suspension and brake components. The last model years even had 6 lug wheels and could tow over 6000 lbs with a weight distribution hitch.


What year did the second generation start? I've been looking at 2000-2005 (last year?)? Thanks again for your help.

Lil M.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby markmitch » January 19th 2019, 4:26am

1st gen is 85 to 94/5 then 96 to 2005 is second gen although some feel there is a 3rd gen mixed in there due to the 4 wheel disc brake vans near the end.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby WimpTech » January 19th 2019, 4:39am

Welcome to the big show!
Come out west, ...and seek your astro fortune. The newest one is 14yo, so slim pickings in ye ole rust belt.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby mcspin50 [OP] » January 19th 2019, 6:05am

@markmitch Thanks for that info!

@WimpTech LOL You're right about rust belt. My '05 T&C has plenty of it along both sides. It looked great when I bought it in 2013.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby astrometalvan » January 19th 2019, 3:42pm

markmitch wrote:1st gen is 85 to 94/5 then 96 to 2005 is second gen although some feel there is a 3rd gen mixed in there due to the 4 wheel disc brake vans near the end.


Gen 2.5? :think:

Are all the six lug 4 wheel disc?
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby tungtide » January 19th 2019, 7:31pm

You pretty much got the scoop, all I can say is welcome. I have two one from Indianna and one from Ohio. Both have a little rust. Consider the tow haul option on the transmission. Without Tow haul you might consider staying in 3rd when towing. Vans with tow haul have a tab right on the signal/indicator right hand side and its quite obvious. Pay attention to whether the hitch is bolted to the frame rails or just the unibody. There was a post on this site where some shop only used the unibody and the hitch fell off.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby SportsBoy » January 19th 2019, 9:21pm

Hope you find a good one soon, here's my input-

03-05 are third gen and have disc brakes all around and 6 lugs.
In '99 on AWDs they switched from the borgwarner transfer case to the new process - which many think is inferior, but is easier to swap with a 4wd unit because the driveshafts make it a direct bolt-on.

A couple other common issues to know of are that the LIM (Lower intake manifold) gasket goes bad, this looks like light colored/milkshake oil or coolant dripping down the side of the engine, usually. If it hasn't been done, there's a good chance you'll have to do it sometime. Replace it with the felpro t permadryplus set and never worry about it again.

Also the pinion bearing (or something like that) tends to go bad in the rear end and make a droning sound until you get it rebuilt/replaced. But you can ignore this for a while until you need to address it tbh (I've ignored it for 8k miles, others have ignored it for 50k miles+)

Also, the ABS system seems like it comes up a lot, but it's an easy fix (documented here).
Also, the vacuum lines tend to disintegrate and make the blower controls weird, or maybe cause weird idle issues and such - also an easy fix documented on the forum.

Having dealt with rust - I'd say go through the hassle of buying from the southwest if you want to keep the van around for a while!
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby AstroWill » January 19th 2019, 9:25pm

astrometalvan wrote:Are all the six lug 4 wheel disc?

Yes. https://sites.google.com/site/astrosafa ... enerations

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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby 1lowcab » January 19th 2019, 10:14pm

In '99 on AWDs they switched from the borgwarner transfer case to the new process - which many think is inferior


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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby 1lowcab » January 19th 2019, 10:16pm

BTW, welcome to the forums.


03-05 are not only 4 wheel disc, they are also physically larger brakes which means better, safer braking for towing.


Having dealt with rust - I'd say go through the hassle of buying from the southwest if you want to keep the van around for a while!


^^ That!
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby 3PedalJohn » January 20th 2019, 1:02am

Welcome!

If I was looking for another Astro I would get a 03-05, they have 6 lug, bigger brakes, discs in rear, and the big kicker is the 4.3 is much better than the TBI and CPI variants. The 03-05 Astros comes with the LU3, which is a true Multiport Fuel Injected engine, one injector for each cylinder. This will give you jam for towing and pulling up grades.

I would recommend adding drum brakes to your trailer along with adding a proportional trailer. Stay away for ceramic brake pads on tow vehicle. You need a WDH when tongue weights exceed 200lbs or trailer weights of over 2000 lbs for the Astro, load carrying coil over are not needed IMO.

Also consider that GM started adding the tow/haul button to control the 4l60e around 99/00. This is a nice feature to have when towing a lot. For towing in the mountain its best to put the Astro in Drive or 3rd gear, this will prevent over heating the transfluid from hunting between 3rd and 4th. look for a van with the Z82 PRO code, this is the HD tow package.

I have been towing heavy with my 1st Gen Astro Van for two years now with all trips averaging 200miles to 500miles one way. Granted its the midwest that I am towing in but the van handles great! I think the 13' Scamp will fit like a glove behind the Astro and tow like a dream.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby 90safari » January 20th 2019, 2:02am

My only advice is to take Wimptech's advice and get one from the south west, or the west coast in general. I've got an 88 Astro that I bought in Texas in 2003. Since I live in the salt belt, I park it in the winter months, which keeps the salt off it. As a result I've owned it for 16 years, and haven't had to do any body welding on it.
But my recommendation is to look for the least rustiest van you find with all of the options you want already in place. Mileage on these vans doesn't seem to matter as a couple of people are pushing the 400K club, and there's plenty of 250K club members here. The mechanicals on these vans are easier to get than doing rust repair.
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Re: Newbie from Minnesota

Postby Mmusicman » January 20th 2019, 3:14am

Welcome from South Florida!
It was 82 and sunny here today. :mrgreen:
A lot of great advice already given.
You may have a challenge finding something decent in Minnesota.. I wish you luck.
I'd try to stay with about 2000-up.. but if you find a really hot deal on an older one, don't hesitate! These vans can give you a lifetime of great service! Lower mileage is always better.. but anything even in the 100+K range still has a lot of life on it yet. Locking rears are great.. AWD's are great (for snow country).. later models are great.

Good luck!
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