Morning no start

[doc_k]

Just a quick question, I read here that if not starting in the AM , to shoot starting fluid to see if it is fuel or electrical. My question is do you remove air cleaner and shoot it in the maf sensor? Does this hurt the maf sensor?

[RECox286]

One quick shot of go juice won't hurt the sensor. If you really are concerned, then remove the intake plumbing and give it a shot downstream of the sensor.

Bob

[doc_k]

Thx Bob. I have a 97 that wouldn't start two days ago. Had this van for two years with no starting problems. It wouldn't start for the first time the other day and I noticed that the FP took longer than usual to prime. It would cough, cough, but not start and FP would run awhile after I turned key off. I put in 4 gals of fuel and it eventually started and the FP priming interval eventually has gone back to normal and the van starts and runs fine just like always. Filling the tank up at station took only 8 gals, so i know I had gas. I'm from the "if it aint broke don't fix" it school and don't have a lot of money to throw at diagnostics. I did some test drives and all is well now. I'm just trying to figure out what happened as I can't afford to go around replacing unnecessary parts or paying some mechanic to tell me nothings wrong now (has happened in the past). Just looking for some ideas on what might have happened. You guys are great and I've learned a lot here, thx

[doc_k]

Update: I drove and restarted van multiple times yestday with no problems. I let it sit overnight and this morning, 2-3 second pump prime, 3 cranks/3 sec and starts up, runs fine, normal, even maybe better. I have a couple questions?

Could I have gotten bad gas and what happens to water in gas. Does it sink to the bottom and possibly freeze?

Is it better(safer) to buy gas from BP, Shell, Mobile, than from independents?

Are there baffles in the gas tank that could break free and cause some restriction problem?

Does the pump work better, i.e. more pressure on a full tank?

Btw gas prices here jumped .20/gal since yesterday

[Phantom]

Yes you could have gotten bad gas , water dilutes the fuel mixture and prevents efficient burn/combustion , water does not ignite or burn causing problems in the engine running properly
Try using a product like Lucas Fuel Treatment with Upper cylinder Lubricant lit really helps , 3 oz treats 10 gallons

Top Tier gas of major brand names can help , but some independents have good gas , but ya never know until it is tested if if is bad

baffles not likely to be any problem unless they rust and send debris clogging fuel filters

[doc_k]

What is Lucas fuel treatment, an oil or solvent? Can it harm or hurt anything like the pump. Is it helpful if water is in gas?

[paintdrying]

Lucus is good stuff. It should not hurt anything. I wonder if the fp relay is starting to have problems?

[Phantom]

It is good stuff , no solvent , a highly refined lube for cleaning and lube ,

It helps keep deposits and moisture out
http://www.lucasoil.com/products/displa ... d=2&iid=26

[RECox286]

It can be disastrous to purchase gas any where immediately after the tanker has dumped a fresh load of fuel in the stations' tank. The injection of fresh fuel stirs up what ever was on the bottom that had a chance to
settle out ie: water, dirt, etc...

Top tier stations will check for water in the fuel, but how often is the question. Finding an indie that has good gas can be a throw of the dice at best, and when you find one, it is a sure thing for only that load of
fuel that they have in their tank. Most times though, there is very little to worry about, as most indies buy from the namebrands. Who else is making gas ???

Bob

[doc_k]

It sez lucas is an detergent oil. Wouldn't that increase deposits in the engine?

The last tank I bought was from a Thorntons who was almost .10/gal cheaper than anyone else in the area. If they buy gas from the Top Tier how can they afford to sell it for less? I was told sometimes cheap gas came from bottom of barges that had water innit and thats why they sold it cheap, who knows.

BTW there is a GREAT site for looking up gas prices, its called GasBuddy.com. you can see all prices in any area of the usa. makes shopping easier

[paintdrying]

The cheap gas is surplus from what everyone else buys. Around here every station is the same price because there is no surplus of fuel. The little stations have trouble making it in times like this. Gas station do not really make money off the gas, they make it off the hot dogs on the rollers. Things like candy bars and such is where the money is at. I get mad just thinking about gas, I need to go lay down.

[chevymaher]

The cheap gas is surplus from what everyone else buys. Around here every station is the same price because there is no surplus of fuel. The little stations have trouble making it in times like this. Gas station do not really make money off the gas, they make it off the hot dogs on the rollers. Things like candy bars and such is where the money is at. I get mad just thinking about gas, I need to go lay down.

Gas is a buck and some change a gallon in the phils.if it was more they could not afford to buy it at all.And if they were not making a profit they would not sell it there at all.Thier gas comes from same place everywhere elses does.when a friend of the families dad told him leave this country because they were raising gas prices he did.Diplomatic imunity or not he would go to jail.Thier family owns oil fields.He told us it all about money they wont run out of oil for thousands of years.just things to think about.This came from the horses mouth so to speak.

[paintdrying]

When I lived out in Cali someone attack a gas station attendant because they thought that poor soul had something to do with the high prices. About a week later there was a little billboard out front showing what they were paying for gas and what they were selling it for. They were making like ten cents a gallon. The price of oil is set in England every morning. I read there is enough oil in I think Montana alone to last a whole lifetime. Oil comes from a bacterial reaction in the ocean, it is constantly replenishing itself. That dead dinosaur idea is ridiculous.

[chevymaher]

When I lived out in Cali someone attack a gas station attendant because they thought that poor soul had something to do with the high prices. About a week later there was a little billboard out front showing what they were paying for gas and what they were selling it for. They were making like ten cents a gallon. The price of oil is set in England every morning. I read there is enough oil in I think Montana alone to last a whole lifetime. Oil comes from a bacterial reaction in the ocean, it is constantly replenishing itself. That dead dinosaur idea is ridiculous.

Exactly there was a report they found decaying plankton at bottom of ocean.Little black balls of goop that were sinking into bedrock and sand.Wonder what that will be when it reaches the table of rock that has oil in it.HUMM.Some times thinking outside the box beneficial. Scientist change theories and such in ten year intervals.Proving beyond a shadow of a doubt they themselves are just taking educated guesses.I can do that for myself thank you very much.

[doc_k]

If every seller pays the same for product, then why the difference in price. I've heard stories of watering down gas. Do those gas additives really work or do they just contribute to deposits in the engine. Can they "clean" a bad fuel sensor?