New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » March 13th 2008, 1:59am

I CAN"T FREAKIN BELIEVE IT!! It's happening again!! I had to get into it pretty hard pulling out of a parking lot last night and that was all she wrote! All the way home I could feel it lugging out and the the damn SES came on AGAIN. The light went out this morning on the way to work but I can feel it's missing and lugging. It's not as BAD as b-4 he put the second pump in but it's there! DAMN I wish this snow would melt so I could crawl under it and check things out! Looks like I'm back to square 1 :banghead:
Don't have a clue where to go next!!!
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby davesyo » March 13th 2008, 2:31am

Did you check for codes ? If the check engine light came on then you should have a code
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » March 13th 2008, 11:00am

Not Yet, but I'll bet it's one of the O2 sensors!! I had O2 Sensor 1 Bank 1 replaced and it threw the same code with the NEW one. They kept saying the Air/Fuel mixture was too lean! Does this sound like a Cat. problem? The problem only happened after I had the Fuel Pump replaced.
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby Clamster » March 13th 2008, 7:21pm

[i]I drive a 90 with throttle body injection so a bit out of your league. The problems I have had with intermitant powerloss,boggs,cruise related stumbling and erratic ses all were solved with cleaning the evil egr valve. I think your egr may be electric and vacuum, some guys with newer truck should pop in here and help hopefully shortly.[/How about taking it for a spin at night with the doghouse off just to see if a sparks jumping to ground at higher rpm. Does this sound practical to anyone else??i]
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » March 13th 2008, 11:49pm

Makes sense to ME. Maybe I'm focusing too much on the New Fuel Pump and that's not the problem at all! It's just that it ran like a top until the Fuel Pump went and since then it's been giving me problems! Maybe I'll do Plugs and Wires this weekend (if it gets above 25 degrees up here)
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby Externet » March 15th 2008, 11:18pm

Hi.
The code you posted earlier says voltage INPUT to the oxygen sensors.
There has to be a 5 volt supply to them. The ECU supplies such reference voltage.
Check the made in Méjico wiring harness connectors, from the ECU all the way to the sensors trough all splices. I think it is a pink wire.
Or, keep a voltmeter inboard permanently hooked to the code reporting oxygen sensor 5V wire.
Not pretty, but intermittent problems have to be caught that way.
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby ScottS » March 16th 2008, 1:16am

It may be a combination of a bad connector and bad motor mounts - just thinking that the code you got was bad supply of voltage to the 02 sensor- and your problem seems to happen when you "get on it" - which may cause the engine to move far enough to yank on a wire or disturb a bad connection. I would trace the supply voltage to the 02 sensor and make sure it s solid.

If you wat to get rally anal, hook a meter up to the sensor input so you can set the meter on the dash and watch the voltage - the situation of pulling out of a parking lot and gettin on it might be tweaking the drivetrain enough to pull a wire or conector that might case the voltage to drop and you will see it
I have even seen wires that were crushed/pinched that look OK but the conductors are broke inside and if you move them they open up and as they bounce around or vibrate they make contact again
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » March 16th 2008, 1:19pm

Thanks for the great suggestions!! Today I did about the only thing I could do with 6" of snow on the ground! I checked the plug wires and put a new Cap and Rotor in it. I haven't gotten a code since the other night and after the cap change I took her out for a little spin NO MISS or Code when I kicked her into "Passing" but it still doesn't feel right (probably my imagination). I'm going for a little trip today and we'll see what happens!(I'll have my Cell Phone with me!) :o
Thanks again for all your help!
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby herbal_gardens » March 19th 2008, 6:01pm

Have you thought about the fuel pressure regulator located inside the intake manifold.
You said that you do most of your own mechanics so I wont break into schematics.

If your fuel pressure regulator is bad (going bad) which ever it may be, it would explain a few problems you are currently having

from the beginning you replaced the pump, (older pumps get weak a newer pump could have pushed enough pressure into the regulator to get it to operate properly temporarily as well as further damage the regulator, this could also explain the lean fuel code your ecm is giving you, as well as a lack of power while driving and your hesitation/misfire.

Also testing the fuel pressure while in operation (as stated in a previous post i read) would tell you alot more about what is going on with your 97.


Food for thought
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » March 20th 2008, 12:27am

I've put about 200 miles on her since the new cap + rotor and so far, so good! The only time I experienced any type of lugging was after a 10 mile run @ 60mph. After I restarted it to head back she was spitting a little but it has since cleared up. Once (if) the weather gets a little better I'll put some plugs and wires into it and see if that clears up the last of it! I tow a 19ft boat around quite a bit and DON"T want any problems when I'm on the way to the lake!
Thanks again for all the advice and suggestions!- This forum still ROCKS!! :banger:
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » May 29th 2008, 2:15am

The Saga Continues!!
Well I took it to the "Mountains" last weekend and it was a Disaster! ANY incline in the road and the van would stutter and NOT accelerate at all!! It would get to the point where I had to pull off the side of the road, shut it off, and then when I re-started it, I had acceleration again (for awhile). I managed to limp it home and replaced the wires, plugs and cap (AC Delco). It runs like a CHAMP when it's cold, I have passing gear when I step on it, it runs smooth, just like it should!! After about 15-20 miles of suburb driving I can feel it start to miss. If I try to kick it in passing gear I get NOTHING! The engine doesn't accelerate and it feels like I took my foot off the gas? I can hear that low throaty growl that you get when you begin to flood her out. So far I haven't thrown any codes but I'm at a TOTAL LOSS as to where to go from here? Could I have gotten ANOTHER bad Fuel Pump?? Is it losing volume when it heats up?
I hate the thought of taking it to ANOTHER shop but I don't know what else to do. It's way too freaky that just turning it off for a minute can restore acceleration.
ANY IDEAS???
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby davesyo » May 30th 2008, 3:22am

I guess the best thing to do is to start with checking fuel pressure again and go from there
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » May 30th 2008, 10:10am

Just so I've got it straight in m head, what should the Fuel Pressure gage read when I'm driving? I guess I should be able to see the difference between the "cold" and the "hot" readings but, what SHOULD be the difference between Idle and Acceleration?
Thanks for the help!!
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby davesyo » May 31st 2008, 2:25am

key on engine off 58-64 . At idle pressure should decrease 3-10 psi .During acceleration my van stays around low 60s
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » June 1st 2008, 6:39pm

Thanks for the information. I've got an appt. with a DIFFERENT shop tomorrow. Maybe they can figure something out! I've taken the doghouse off already cause I think they tack $150.00 on to the bill if THEY have to do it!
I'll keep ya updated!
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » June 4th 2008, 10:40am

Took it to the shop and he told me it is throwing a Code P1351 and that the Ignition Coil is breaking up when hot! That made perfect sense to me and pretty much explained the problem of it only running like junk when it was warmed up! Unfortunately, he wanted $266.00 to replace the $59.00 coil so I thanked him , paid the $90.00 Diagnostic charge and did it myself. It runs better BUT, I went down state for a meeting last night and had the Cruise set @ 65MPH there is 1 hill going down there and as SOON as the Tranny tried to kick it down I got the SAME OLD PROBLEM. No acceleration at all. The RPM's dropped and the speed kept dropping until I finally made it over the top!
Now I'm totally confused on what to do next?? Should I throw a new ICM in it as well? Could it be a Transmission Problem (had to have it rebuilt last year and I notice the Speedo is acting funny, not smooth but jerky) Should I take it to a Dealer, hoping that they can do a better Diagnostic?
ANY advice would be GREATLY appreciated!!!-- This thing ran GREAT until the Fuel Pump crapped out!
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby ScottS » June 4th 2008, 12:55pm

If you go through this entire thread and identify all the different issues, I think they are all electrical- heck your fuel pump may have been an electrical problem too.

You must have an intermittent connection in a key ground or supply wire that is causing components to malfunction.

If this was my van, I would start by identifying every ground connection ( where the harness connects to ground) at the engine and the chassis, take them apart and clean them and measure resistance with a meter when you reassemble.

I suspect it may be near the engine since you had the problems with making turns and accelerating - I still think a connector or wire is moving and giving you intermittent connections.

Bad connections, cause resistance which causes heat , so when they heat up due to the resistance they typically get worse.

Check all the wiring to the coil with extreme prejudice.

For the coil, you could hook up acouple meters on the ground and spply wirs and mesaure the voltage while you drive and see if the connections are the problem.

These wring problems canbe hard to trace, you have to be systematc.
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » June 6th 2008, 2:59am

I guess you could very well be right. Out of desperation last night I pulled off the "new" rotor cap and took a peek. It was brass 2 months ago and now its got white powder on all the terminals. I took some emery cloth to them and shined them up and the van ran like a dream to work this morning. BUT on the way home tonight it was 86 degrees out and the thing started acting up even sooner and worse than usual! I had to pull over 3 times, turn OFF the ignition, wait for 30 seconds and fire it back up in order to get home! I have an appointment at ANOTHER shop on Monday, we'll see what they say- I'm tired of screwing around with it!
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby Matrixx » June 6th 2008, 6:43am

Hi DonK
I would suggest OEM Cap and Rotor to start with (not brass). In this particular area (Cap and Rotor) their has been ALOT of after market name brands throwing out junk lately. The white hazing you see in the cap is a "Classic" symptom of it. That white you see is "Arcing" traces from a "cheap" product, especially when you just replaced them. It may not be the problem you have now, but I can Guarantee you it will be in very short order and another mess to sort out. Mine cost me $150.00 in a tow bills before I went back to OEM, and that was about 8 years ago now and not a stitch of trouble from that point on in that department. Just a highly recommended suggestion, but it's your choice. :)

From this point on DonK with your current problem, the only thing I would suggest now is to hook a scanner up to it that is capable of "live" readings and make sure everything is functioning correctly. The reason this problem is so hard to find is because it's "intermittent". You need a scanner that can see things working "live" to catch that 'intermittent" when it does appear. Hope this helps, please keep us updated, thanks. :)

PS: Also have the Coil checked as well if possible. :)
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Re: New Fuel Pump-New Problems

Postby DonK [OP] » June 7th 2008, 2:45am

The thing that kills me is that the problem ISN'T Intermittent. I know exactly when it's gonna happen- when the darn thing heats up ! It was 90 Deg. today and I barely made it a mile b-4 it started with the No Acceleration and Missing. I have gone thru the list of new parts I've thrown at it
2- New Fuel Pumps
2- Fuel Filters
2- Rotors and Caps- last one OEM
New Plugs
New Wires
New Coil
New ICM

Unfortunately I don't have the Time or the Patience to go thru EVERY Ground and connection so I guess it's time to pay the "Professionals" and see how many New parts they tell me I need!!
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